“Not them and us, it’s we”.
“Not them and us, it’s we”., originally uploaded by Michaela5.
This is Barbara Biggins’ entry for the Archibald Prize, a portrait of Father Bob. Note the spelling of the artist, we previously posted a blog namins her as Biggs, but Bob since corrected the name. Bob reckons he looks like he has a dislocated jaw, and he might look a bit pious with the chalice in the frame. Let us know what you think.
February 1st, 2007 at 7:07 pm
dislocated jaw? I think so too!
oi don’ts know much about art but oi knows what oi loiks and oi quoit loiks this…
February 4th, 2007 at 12:10 pm
Listened to the show, 2:00 pm Sat PST
From California,
I grew up listening to this argument from my father. Dad was raised a Kansas Methodist. No smoking, no drinking, no dancing, no swaring, no cards (you might gamble). My aunt, my Dad’s sister said, “My Dad never hugged me”. She of course was speaking of my grandfather, a Victorian born in the 1880s. My Dad ended up being an aethist. Should we be supprised?
Dad had his Phd. in Math and M.S. in Physics. I already heard everything you two spoke of. Anger at “Religion/God” for all the suffering in the world or how God allowed man to pervert mans belief in God to be used as a tool of control. Well whats so suprising about that? Bad people will do anything for power. So we blame God? You can be angry at the people that practice the religion, but don’t be angry at God, you seem to not believe God does not exist anyway.
The truth is you do not want to be lied to, manipulated or a target for any reason. Open your mind to the difference between an ancient institution used by humans for power. And human beings with all there frailties attempting to connect with each other and with a force they can not explain, or reason that they feel is the core of who they are as a human, that they call God or the Holy Spirt. It transends reason the way you love a song, or a photo, a dance, a child, a parent or a spouce. There is no formula, you believe for you, so it is true. That in part is why some folks gather at Church. To connect to God and each other as they understand.
Are there trappings of power at Churches? Yes. Any religion, any human organization that gathers more than one person has that problem.
Religion has been used to control. That is why I believe we should never go to war in the name of God. I think it offends Gods to say we kill for God. This is not to say that it is not necessary to defend our loved ones in our home. But where is the line drawn? This is why we vote, this is why we make laws.
Science needs Religion like a fish needs a bicycle. If you’ve got an axe to grind about religion/God, go home and talk to your primary care givers. If there still alive, if not write a letter or join a support group.
If you think the world will have “less” problems without religion/God. Well wait a minute, according to you… there is no God. So what’s the problem? Oh yeh. Religion, Bad people don’t go away just because a tool for Bad people goes away. Is it a knife for eating dinner or for killing a person? Do I have a belief in God to worship or for killing a person? Do you get it?
And be nice to Father Bob. He is a guest and should be treated as such.
February 4th, 2007 at 12:59 pm
Hi David. You’ve got me pegged all wrong. I’m not “angry” at religion or god. I’m just calling it out as a dangerous, immoral, out-dated human concept which I believe the human race needs to wipe out, in the same way we have mostly wiped out slavery and segregation (at least in the Western world).
It’s not just the people who work in God’s name that do bad things. It’s Yahweh himself who, according to his own book, is a pretty mean and nasty individual. Go re-read the OT. He torched cities, told “his people” to murder in his name, he even flooded the entire world and killed off everyone except a single family. Men, women, children, babies, animals, cute bunny rabbits - all destroyed. And why? Because he was angry and jealous. This very concept of a violent, bloodthirsty god is the reason why so much evil has been done (and continues to be done) in his name. And you think he is “offended” by people saying they kill for him? Again, go re-read the book. He gave explicit ORDERS to people to kill in his name.
I think the world would have less excuses for mindless, bloodthirsty atrocities if we took away religion as a justification, yes.
I’m tired of hearing this excuse “it’s not religion that’s bad, it’s humans”. There is no religion without humans. As you say, it’s a human institution. It just happens to be one that has always been founded (at least as far as Yahweh is concerned) with violence and bloodshed and intolerance.
I find no acceptable excuses for allowing it to continue.
And I am nice to Bob. I respect his intellect so much I’m even willing to challenge him. If I didn’t respect him so much I’d just ignore him.
February 4th, 2007 at 3:24 pm
You were nice to Father Bob in that show? I must have listened to a different show.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/nice
nice /naɪs/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[nahys] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective, nic·er, nic·est. 1. pleasing; agreeable; delightful: a nice visit.
2. amiably pleasant; kind: They are always nice to strangers.
You need to ask yourself why you produce the show.
February 5th, 2007 at 6:54 am
comrades, for “God’s Word”,eg Torah,Gospels and Letters and Revelation,Quran decode to discover “God’s People’s Word”.What was written by people of religions of THE BOOK,as they’re called, applies to the writers’ times, places, politics, climate.The writers tell the story of a God their times and places need then and there.”Our God said and did this” means we need,right now a God who will say and do this and that.This is a stop gap measure, a ‘religious breathing space’, a sticking of the finger in the hole in the leaking dam while our lot, “people”, plot and plan solutions to socio-economic problems.To read “God’s Word” otherwise OF COURSE leads to God abuse.Respect.bobmaguire.